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	<title>Comments on: Popping That &#8220;No Housing Bubble in Houston&#8221;&#160;Myth</title>
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	<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/</link>
	<description>Houston, Texas real estate development, home buying, landscape, and design</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:40:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: kjb434</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26757</link>
		<dc:creator>kjb434</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 14:54:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26757</guid>
		<description>"anyone can use unsubtantiated rumor and hyperbole in lieu of facts, a la Fox ‘News’, to support his or her weltenshung."

You actually believe that?  To me, all three cable news channels are quite a load of crap with MSNBC being the worst.  Obviously newspapers are worthless.  The best coverage of any US news is coming from the UK papers (not BBC though).

Anyway as with all information from any source, blanket trust should never be used.  The MLS, although comprehensive, can have errors because humans are behind it.  Now, it doesn't mean that every entry is flawed to push some kind of misinformation.  If it was, that would break as a story eventually.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;anyone can use unsubtantiated rumor and hyperbole in lieu of facts, a la Fox ‘News’, to support his or her weltenshung.&#8221;</p>
<p>You actually believe that?  To me, all three cable news channels are quite a load of crap with MSNBC being the worst.  Obviously newspapers are worthless.  The best coverage of any US news is coming from the UK papers (not BBC though).</p>
<p>Anyway as with all information from any source, blanket trust should never be used.  The MLS, although comprehensive, can have errors because humans are behind it.  Now, it doesn&#8217;t mean that every entry is flawed to push some kind of misinformation.  If it was, that would break as a story eventually.</p>
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		<title>By: Darby Mom</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26755</link>
		<dc:creator>Darby Mom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 14:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26755</guid>
		<description>My past experiences with licensed real estate agents have been honest and professional. When one has an ax to grind, though, anyone can use unsubtantiated rumor and hyperbole in lieu of facts, a la Fox 'News', to support his or her weltenshung.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My past experiences with licensed real estate agents have been honest and professional. When one has an ax to grind, though, anyone can use unsubtantiated rumor and hyperbole in lieu of facts, a la Fox &#8216;News&#8217;, to support his or her weltenshung.</p>
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		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26658</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 19:14:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26658</guid>
		<description>There has already been significant price depreciation at the top of the market in these areas. Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse? There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.
__________________________________________

Not all homes in River Oaks are sold on the open market through the friendly neighborhood Realtor.  Some are sold by  the friendly family attorney. And there have been some "pre-foreclosures" sold already there and in Tanglewood and Memorial. If you have a $2 million loan you need to cover on a $3 million home and have a "willing buyer" a friend introduced you to who has $2 million in cash, you are going to sell the home - your loan is paid off, your credit is intact and best of all you didn't have to cough up $120,000 in commission to a Realtor out of your dwindling capital. Pity the poor person who finds out they paid $3.5 million for their house and the next door neighbor only paid $2 million even though it's bigger. It is happening here. 

As for other markets not having any relevance to the market here, the effect of the collapsing economy is merely being seen first in other markets. A number of homes in these other markets, Los Angeles and New York in particular, have been sold through "pocket listings" which means the listing broker brings the buyer and if the broker wants to co-op the sale, the broker pays the other broker out of his commission which usually doesn't happen because there is no MLS and no advertisement allowed. Word of mouth or your own customers only. Some simply don't want just anyone schlepping through their living rooms with the Picassos on the walls but some simply don't want anyone to know they're selling and wondering if they're  selling because they need to. Which most are.  Rumor is some brokers here have begun to take "pocket listings" despite their always having refused to. Until now. The "pocket listings" tend to bring a better price but in this market if the house is priced for a "willing buyer" rather than the market itself it sits there. Along with everything else.  There has been devaluation in our market. Some refuse to accept that. Including many of the friendly neighborhood Realtors.  

The difference between a $500,000 house and a $750,000 house is $15,000 in commission.  If you're a good agent and tend to sell your own listings, you are going to try to make that extra $15,000.  If and when you sell the $500,000 house for $750,000.

People have been paying too much for their homes in our city the past five to ten years. The Realtors loved it. As did HCAD.  Reality is reality. And eventually reality will hit the Inner Loop although to a degree it already has. It just hasn't hit the Realtors or their sellers who can't figure out why their house is still sitting there in this market that's still so wonderful according to their Realtors. 

Bellaire may not be Bel-Air but the reality is the same.  And the reality is it ain't worth what is was worth a year ago. Just as the $7,500,000 home in Bel-Air ain't worth it, the $750,000 home in Bellaire ain't worth it. Unless you find a fool who doesn't know better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There has already been significant price depreciation at the top of the market in these areas. Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse? There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.<br />
__________________________________________</p>
<p>Not all homes in River Oaks are sold on the open market through the friendly neighborhood Realtor.  Some are sold by  the friendly family attorney. And there have been some &#8220;pre-foreclosures&#8221; sold already there and in Tanglewood and Memorial. If you have a $2 million loan you need to cover on a $3 million home and have a &#8220;willing buyer&#8221; a friend introduced you to who has $2 million in cash, you are going to sell the home - your loan is paid off, your credit is intact and best of all you didn&#8217;t have to cough up $120,000 in commission to a Realtor out of your dwindling capital. Pity the poor person who finds out they paid $3.5 million for their house and the next door neighbor only paid $2 million even though it&#8217;s bigger. It is happening here. </p>
<p>As for other markets not having any relevance to the market here, the effect of the collapsing economy is merely being seen first in other markets. A number of homes in these other markets, Los Angeles and New York in particular, have been sold through &#8220;pocket listings&#8221; which means the listing broker brings the buyer and if the broker wants to co-op the sale, the broker pays the other broker out of his commission which usually doesn&#8217;t happen because there is no MLS and no advertisement allowed. Word of mouth or your own customers only. Some simply don&#8217;t want just anyone schlepping through their living rooms with the Picassos on the walls but some simply don&#8217;t want anyone to know they&#8217;re selling and wondering if they&#8217;re  selling because they need to. Which most are.  Rumor is some brokers here have begun to take &#8220;pocket listings&#8221; despite their always having refused to. Until now. The &#8220;pocket listings&#8221; tend to bring a better price but in this market if the house is priced for a &#8220;willing buyer&#8221; rather than the market itself it sits there. Along with everything else.  There has been devaluation in our market. Some refuse to accept that. Including many of the friendly neighborhood Realtors.  </p>
<p>The difference between a $500,000 house and a $750,000 house is $15,000 in commission.  If you&#8217;re a good agent and tend to sell your own listings, you are going to try to make that extra $15,000.  If and when you sell the $500,000 house for $750,000.</p>
<p>People have been paying too much for their homes in our city the past five to ten years. The Realtors loved it. As did HCAD.  Reality is reality. And eventually reality will hit the Inner Loop although to a degree it already has. It just hasn&#8217;t hit the Realtors or their sellers who can&#8217;t figure out why their house is still sitting there in this market that&#8217;s still so wonderful according to their Realtors. </p>
<p>Bellaire may not be Bel-Air but the reality is the same.  And the reality is it ain&#8217;t worth what is was worth a year ago. Just as the $7,500,000 home in Bel-Air ain&#8217;t worth it, the $750,000 home in Bellaire ain&#8217;t worth it. Unless you find a fool who doesn&#8217;t know better.</p>
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		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26655</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 18:35:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26655</guid>
		<description>If Mr. Matt believes certain sales figures state in the Houston MLS are not true, he should contact the Houston Association of Realtors and see about filing a complaint. If an exchange of funds is not stated on the closing statement, that’s illegal. The MLS now includes amounts when closing costs or repairs have been credited to buyers.
___________________________________________

Unless something has changed, the MLS figure is the figure reported to MLS. Not verified by MLS. You figure it out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If Mr. Matt believes certain sales figures state in the Houston MLS are not true, he should contact the Houston Association of Realtors and see about filing a complaint. If an exchange of funds is not stated on the closing statement, that’s illegal. The MLS now includes amounts when closing costs or repairs have been credited to buyers.<br />
___________________________________________</p>
<p>Unless something has changed, the MLS figure is the figure reported to MLS. Not verified by MLS. You figure it out.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Blount</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26643</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Blount</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 17:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26643</guid>
		<description>Summer weather is simply a correlation.  The real reason sales boom is due to families relocating while kids are out of school during the summer.  The sharp drop off in closings at the end of summer is due to school returning to session.  Very nice analysis though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Summer weather is simply a correlation.  The real reason sales boom is due to families relocating while kids are out of school during the summer.  The sharp drop off in closings at the end of summer is due to school returning to session.  Very nice analysis though.</p>
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		<title>By: kjb434</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26638</link>
		<dc:creator>kjb434</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:51:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26638</guid>
		<description>Name the person who can predict the peak or bottom of any market and I'll gladly hand over my investments to them.

People can watch trends and predict something is near or past, but rarely has anyone predicted the peak or bottom.

Historically, it takes about 2 years for most markets to recover from a housing bottom, but that isn't set in stone.  Some markets rotted away (Detroit) and some markets just flattened out (one prediction for Houston).

Houston having a flat market for a while is not necessarily a bad then.  It could be a prolonged bottom.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Name the person who can predict the peak or bottom of any market and I&#8217;ll gladly hand over my investments to them.</p>
<p>People can watch trends and predict something is near or past, but rarely has anyone predicted the peak or bottom.</p>
<p>Historically, it takes about 2 years for most markets to recover from a housing bottom, but that isn&#8217;t set in stone.  Some markets rotted away (Detroit) and some markets just flattened out (one prediction for Houston).</p>
<p>Houston having a flat market for a while is not necessarily a bad then.  It could be a prolonged bottom.</p>
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		<title>By: DMc</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26636</link>
		<dc:creator>DMc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:41:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26636</guid>
		<description>Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse? There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.
----
Saying any area is immune for downturn is a sure way to place a losing bet. Ever heard of a "sure thing"?  I don't have the history; can somene help out?  Were these... or ANY... areas of HOUTX immune from the local real estate downturn in the 80s?

The HOUTX market shows many indicators of a peaking market. It's naive to believe that the local market will remain in a vacuum of a deteriorating economy, and widely declining RE marketplace. This is just the leading edge. Any decline or collapse is just gathering momentum. Buckle up!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse? There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.<br />
&#8212;-<br />
Saying any area is immune for downturn is a sure way to place a losing bet. Ever heard of a &#8220;sure thing&#8221;?  I don&#8217;t have the history; can somene help out?  Were these&#8230; or ANY&#8230; areas of HOUTX immune from the local real estate downturn in the 80s?</p>
<p>The HOUTX market shows many indicators of a peaking market. It&#8217;s naive to believe that the local market will remain in a vacuum of a deteriorating economy, and widely declining RE marketplace. This is just the leading edge. Any decline or collapse is just gathering momentum. Buckle up!</p>
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		<title>By: devans</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26634</link>
		<dc:creator>devans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:21:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26634</guid>
		<description>As long as we all agree that inner-loop homes are holding value better than those in far-flung exurban areas, then I've got no quibble with the posters' broad analysis.

However, the regional numbers are only interesting from the macro view.  North
Katy has very little in common with North Boulevard.

I strongly believe that solid, close-in
properties will suffer only a small dip
and a rebound as the recession runs its course.  I also believe that Houston will suffer only a fraction of the damage that we see/will continue to see in the wildly overbuilt regions.

Inside-The-Loop-Houston has some of the best fundamentals in the country, bar none (no giant $ runup, OK economy w/giant health care segment, low home cost as % of personal income, high % of properties NOT financed w/liar, etc. loans, consolidation of energy staffing to Houston, vibrant port and more).

Almost without exception, close-in Houston homeowners are among the most fortunate in the nation - possibly the world - as we all muddle through the real estate bubble.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As long as we all agree that inner-loop homes are holding value better than those in far-flung exurban areas, then I&#8217;ve got no quibble with the posters&#8217; broad analysis.</p>
<p>However, the regional numbers are only interesting from the macro view.  North<br />
Katy has very little in common with North Boulevard.</p>
<p>I strongly believe that solid, close-in<br />
properties will suffer only a small dip<br />
and a rebound as the recession runs its course.  I also believe that Houston will suffer only a fraction of the damage that we see/will continue to see in the wildly overbuilt regions.</p>
<p>Inside-The-Loop-Houston has some of the best fundamentals in the country, bar none (no giant $ runup, OK economy w/giant health care segment, low home cost as % of personal income, high % of properties NOT financed w/liar, etc. loans, consolidation of energy staffing to Houston, vibrant port and more).</p>
<p>Almost without exception, close-in Houston homeowners are among the most fortunate in the nation - possibly the world - as we all muddle through the real estate bubble.</p>
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		<title>By: SD</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26633</link>
		<dc:creator>SD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:14:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26633</guid>
		<description>There has already been significant price depreciation at the top of the market in these areas.  Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse?  There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There has already been significant price depreciation at the top of the market in these areas.  Do you really think River Oaks, West U, etc is going to collapse?  There are not going to be many forced sales in these areas and plenty of people are still buying homes here.</p>
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		<title>By: Sbrian</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26632</link>
		<dc:creator>Sbrian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26632</guid>
		<description>In terms of the inflation picture, one risk to home prices is if the Fed increases interest rates to fight off potential inflation. Keep in mind this is one of the main objectives of the Fed and they will almost certainly do this. Now they may somewhat miss the mark, and we will stil have some inflation. But to control inflation, they will raise interest rates, effectively making the cost of homeownership higher. Right now, the cost of homeownership is artificially high, since interest rates are at unsustainable low levels. When interests rates go up, that same monthly payments buys a much cheaper house. Therefore, home prices may come down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In terms of the inflation picture, one risk to home prices is if the Fed increases interest rates to fight off potential inflation. Keep in mind this is one of the main objectives of the Fed and they will almost certainly do this. Now they may somewhat miss the mark, and we will stil have some inflation. But to control inflation, they will raise interest rates, effectively making the cost of homeownership higher. Right now, the cost of homeownership is artificially high, since interest rates are at unsustainable low levels. When interests rates go up, that same monthly payments buys a much cheaper house. Therefore, home prices may come down.</p>
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		<title>By: Darby Mom</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26631</link>
		<dc:creator>Darby Mom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:13:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26631</guid>
		<description>Guess your glass is half empty, Mr. Matt.  Again, real estate is local. Texas is not California. Houston is not Los Angeles. Grind your ax all you want, but I believe Mr. Mandell is correct for his market.  At the same time, some areas of Pearland are in deep distress due to foreclosures bringing the prices down and deep discounts by builders with excess inventory. If Mr. Matt believes certain sales figures state in the Houston MLS are not true, he should contact the Houston Association of Realtors and see about filing a complaint. If an exchange of funds is not stated on the closing statement, that's illegal.  The MLS now includes amounts when closing costs or repairs have been credited to buyers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guess your glass is half empty, Mr. Matt.  Again, real estate is local. Texas is not California. Houston is not Los Angeles. Grind your ax all you want, but I believe Mr. Mandell is correct for his market.  At the same time, some areas of Pearland are in deep distress due to foreclosures bringing the prices down and deep discounts by builders with excess inventory. If Mr. Matt believes certain sales figures state in the Houston MLS are not true, he should contact the Houston Association of Realtors and see about filing a complaint. If an exchange of funds is not stated on the closing statement, that&#8217;s illegal.  The MLS now includes amounts when closing costs or repairs have been credited to buyers.</p>
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		<title>By: Sbrian</title>
		<link>http://swamplot.com/popping-that-no-housing-bubble-in-houston-myth/2009-04-29/#comment-26630</link>
		<dc:creator>Sbrian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:01:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swamplot.com/?p=8643#comment-26630</guid>
		<description>The "inner loop" is more desirable, or that WestU or River Oaks are more desirable are those same bogus arguments made about other locations. Look at the San Francisco market for a good comparison. First, the suburbs had price depreciation of 30-50%, and everyone said, "but the inner city of San Francisco is so desirable, so it is an exception." I just came back from San Francisco looking for a summer home. Prices inside the city are free-falling. New construction has virtually stopped. Inventory numbers have been creeping up, so it was only time when prices would have to fall. Simple economics. If you consider the massive price appreciation in the inner loop the last few years, it is a bubble--and it will pop.

Historically, prices are driven by the labor market. Many employers are downsizing and no offering raises to their employees. There are hiring freezes at many of the area's largest employers. So who is going to buy these expensive homes?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;inner loop&#8221; is more desirable, or that WestU or River Oaks are more desirable are those same bogus arguments made about other locations. Look at the San Francisco market for a good comparison. First, the suburbs had price depreciation of 30-50%, and everyone said, &#8220;but the inner city of San Francisco is so desirable, so it is an exception.&#8221; I just came back from San Francisco looking for a summer home. Prices inside the city are free-falling. New construction has virtually stopped. Inventory numbers have been creeping up, so it was only time when prices would have to fall. Simple economics. If you consider the massive price appreciation in the inner loop the last few years, it is a bubble&#8211;and it will pop.</p>
<p>Historically, prices are driven by the labor market. Many employers are downsizing and no offering raises to their employees. There are hiring freezes at many of the area&#8217;s largest employers. So who is going to buy these expensive homes?</p>
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